Community Health person at CEA (opinions here my own).
Personal website: www.chanamessinger.com
About going to a hub to do networking:
A response to: https://forum.effectivealtruism.org/posts/M5GoKkWtBKEGMCFHn/what-s-the-theory-of-change-of-come-to-the-bay-over-the
I think there's a lot of truth to the points made in this post.
I also think it's worth flagging that several of them: networking with a certain subset of EAs, asking for 1:1 meetings with them, being in certain office spaces - are at least somewhat zero sum, such that the more people take this advice, the less available these things will actually be to each person, and possibly on net if it starts to overwhelm. (I can also imagine increasingly unhealthy or competitive dynamics forming, but I'm hoping that doesn't happen!)
Second flag is that I don't know how many people reading this can expect to have an experience similar to yours. They may, but they may not end up being connected in all the same ways, and I want people to go knowing that they take that as a risk and to decide whether it's worth it for them.
On the other side, people taking this advice can do a lot of great networking and creating a common culture of ambition and taking ideas seriously with each other, without the same set of expectations around what connections they'll end up making.
Third flag is I have an un-fleshed out worry that this advice funges against doing things outside Berkeley/SF that are more valuable career capital in the future for ever doing EA things outside of EA or bringing valuable skills and knowledge to EA (like, will we wish in 5 years that EAs had more outside professional experience to bring domain knowledge and legitimacy to EA projects rather than a resume full of EA things?). This concern will need to be fleshed out empirically and will vary a lot in applicability by person.
(I work on CEA's community health team but am not making this post on behalf of that team)
About going to a hub
A response to: https://forum.effectivealtruism.org/posts/M5GoKkWtBKEGMCFHn/what-s-the-theory-of-change-of-come-to-the-bay-over-the
For people who consider taking or end up taking this advice, some things I'd say if we were having a 1:1 coffee about it:
We all want (I claim) EA to be a high trust, truth-seeking, impact-oriented professional community and social space. Help it be those things. Blurt truth (but be mostly nice), have integrity, try to avoid status and social games, make shit happen.
For people who consider taking or end up taking this advice, some things I'd say if we were having a 1:1 coffee about it:
We all want (I claim) EA to be a high trust, truth-seeking, impact-oriented professional community and social space. Help it be those things. Blurt truth (but be mostly nice), have integrity, try to avoid status and social games, make shit happen.
I think there's a lot of truth to the points made in this post.
I also think it's worth flagging that several of them: networking with a certain subset of EAs, asking for 1:1 meetings with them, being in certain office spaces - are at least somewhat zero sum, such that the more people take this advice, the less available these things will actually be to each person, and possibly on net if it starts to overwhelm. (I can also imagine increasingly unhealthy or competitive dynamics forming, but I'm hoping that doesn't happen!)
Second flag is that I don't know how many people reading this can expect to have an experience similar to yours. They may, but they may not end up being connected in all the same ways, and I want people to go knowing that they take that as a risk and to decide whether it's worth it for them.
On the other side, people taking this advice can do a lot of great networking and creating a common culture of ambition and taking ideas seriously with each other, without the same set of expectations around what connections they'll end up making.
Third flag is I have an un-fleshed out worry that this advice funges against doing things outside Berkeley/SF that are more valuable career capital in the future for ever doing EA things outside of EA or bringing valuable skills and knowledge to EA (like, will we wish in 5 years that EAs had more outside professional experience to bring domain knowledge and legitimacy to EA projects rather than a resume full of EA things?). This concern will need to be fleshed out empirically and will vary a lot in applicability by person.
(I work on CEA's community health team but am not making this post on behalf of that team)
This is super interesting!
You mentioned "observing their effects on a generation of worried youth, at a variety of EA-adjacent and rationality-community-adjacent events."
What are you seeing as the effects on the young people in the community?
I appreciate you thinking through ideas of presentation to new people! I've also spent some time thinking about how to make things not seem as weird, and when that's useful.
One thought is had is that, while it's true that pandemics are really bad and don't need to be described as an existential risk for that to be true, it feels like it relies strongly on other people thinking "what's an actual existential risk" and then back generating reasons why those things are also bad separate from that. I think there are costs and benefits to that dual step process, but one cost is that we lose the focus on the actual discerning principle that generates good ideas, which seems more important to me than communicating those good ideas well (though I'd be really sad if we failed at getting a bunch of CS students thinking about AI Safety only because of framings).
Thanks for writing about your experience, especially in the face of the EA forum being an intimidating place.
I'm curious if the organizations asked any open ended questions that let you signal your alignment, or allowed/asked for a cover letter that would have given you that opportunity.
Obvious point might be too obvious to say, but have you applied for 80k advising?
Intended to donate in December and then again in January and had too many credit card issues, just maxed out my donation right now because of this post. Thanks!
Nice! I wonder if having an intro email template would be useful for making it less aversive.
Very, very strong encouragement for a norm of asking for permission before introducing two people, I think it's pretty unpleasant to have that foisted on you, and it's hard to say no.